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All – A lot of what is being discussed here seems to be going the route of good input to Andrew’s long-term effort. I’ve been otherwise busy for the past couple days, and am going to spend what I expect to be a fair amount of time today culling
through the various emails in an attempt to digest the key points for our guiding principles discussion. Expect some sort of summary late today or perhaps over the weekend.
Thanks for the good discussion, and try to distill the long-term lessons in it for Andrew’s group. -george From: ***** IEEE 802 Executive Committee List ***** <STDS-802-SEC@ieee.org>
On Behalf Of John D'Ambrosia All, I would caution everyone to making blanket statements based on their experience if they are in a limited number of activities. Here Is my $0.02 The effectiveness, new attendance and participation, IMO have been highly dependent on the topic, meeting and group of individuals. I personally believe that 802 EC style meetings can be run effectively virtually – and the desire for F2F is based on “that’s the way we always did it” Based on my study group and task force - I have had two totally different experiences –
The IEEE P802.3cw Task Force experience has been more akin to what Chad describes where it often appears tough to fill up the time for a call. However, I think this is related to the standard itself, and there are a limited number of experts
in the world. I have seen some slight pickups in attendance and participation from people who I am not sure would participate otherwise. The Beyond 400 Gb/s Study Group has been the total opposite – attendance / participation – up, easy to fill up and go past 3 hr meeting limits, and people are making it work. However, I will also note that there have been times where F2F
would have helped – so even in a single group – there may be times where the F2F would have helped. However, a hybrid environment would not allow a full read of the room, so I think our past experiences may be subject to change based on the use of the hybrid
model. Therefore, I would be against broad statements and limited approaches to satisfy a group that has had its own experience without permitting other groups that have been able to be effective to have a tool at its disposal as well. And I don’t think we can blame burnout on IEEE – other groups are doing this – as are businesses – clearly this is a sign of the times. J From: ***** IEEE 802 Executive Committee List ***** <STDS-802-SEC@ieee.org>
On Behalf Of Chad Jones (cmjones) Geoff, I will add that I’ve learned that I have what appears to be increased attendance, but I have not noticed an increase in participation. In fact, I’m having a hard time filling a two-hour meeting every other week. I’m seeing teleconference
meeting burn out for sure. Chad Jones Technical Leader, Cisco Systems Chair, IEEE P802.3da Task Force Principal, NFPA 70 CMP3 From: "thompson@ieee.org" <thompson@ieee.org> Folks- While I might have worded my sentiments differently, I fully agree with Chad. The legacy quality of our meetings (and thus of our products) is highly dependent on the full 3 dimensional bandwidth (time > 2hours, face2face vs network, mtg room+hallway+bar+meals
vs network+phone+e-mail) of Face 2 Face meetings. We have all experienced this and I think all agree with it. (The SA does. That's why they have been sending staff to our meetings for years) We have done "remote participation" over the last 18 months because it was better than nothing. The trick over the "short term" (i.e. that period in time when we have our 1st F2F mtg and when travel is "as easy" as it was before) is how do we get the value from and to our
participants who can't yet travel because of the lingering effects of Covid. The trick over the "long term" (i.e. when travel is "as easy" as it was before) is how do get back to normal or better based on what we have learned during the "days of remote." I'm not sure that we have learned anything that is beneficial during the "days of remote" other than (a) we get increased attendance with remote access and (b) people prefer paying
less money with remote access. Just my 2 cents. Geoff Thompson GraCaSI S.A./Independent On Wednesday, August 18, 2021, 02:00:56 PM PDT, Chad Jones (cmjones) <00000b60b3f54e8d-dmarc-request@ieee.org>
wrote: I disagree with Steve. I don’t want remote attendees expecting an identical experience to an in-person meeting. We all know there are limitations based
on the last 18 months. I don’t want this falling on the chair to ensure parity for remote versus local attendees – and we all know there are people that will complain that they were disenfranchised when they chose to not attend in person. I like dividing into
classes to correctly set expectations. Cheers, Chad Jones Technical Leader, Cisco Systems Chair, IEEE P802.3da Task Force Principal, NFPA 70 CMP3 From:
***** IEEE 802 Executive Committee List ***** <STDS-802-SEC@ieee.org> on behalf of Steve Shellhammer <sshellha@QTI.QUALCOMM.COM> All, I do not see why whether the participant cannot attend in person or chooses not to attend in person will affect the person’s level of
participation. It seems to me the level of participation for a remote participant depends on whether the participate can join the Meeting Tool (e.g.
WebEx) or is just on Audio. If the person can join the Meeting Tool, then the participant can see and hear the presentation, and can ask questions and can give a
presentation. I cannot support dividing remote participants into classes based on why they are not attending in person. I am fine with requiring a computer to join the Meeting Tool and if the participate only has an Audio connection (which is rare) they
must live with the fact they are not on the Meeting Tool. Regards, Steve From: ***** IEEE 802 Executive Committee List ***** <STDS-802-SEC@ieee.org>
On Behalf Of Beth Kochuparambil (edonnay) WARNING:
This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros. Hello Team – Thanks for a good discussion today! The proposed Guiding Principle as in the document: When remote participation is the only means of participating for a significant portion of the attendees, then we should
strive to provide an equivalent experience for in person and remote participants. If remote participation is optional, the remote participant may not have an equivalent experience to an in person participant.
A suggested modification and added principles for discussion:
In our discussions, the questions were asked, how do we determine travel restrictions of individuals. I could see using something such as
https://www.iatatravelcentre.com/world.php (or likewise, if announced) to verify information entered at the time of registration. As long as a centralized site is used for the meeting,
other sites could also be used/announced by the EC. This is just a suggestion. ~Beth From: ***** IEEE 802 Executive Committee List ***** <STDS-802-SEC@ieee.org>
On Behalf Of Paul Nikolich Dear All, The updated best practices document based on the 16:00-17:00 ET 17 August 2021 meeting is now available at https://mentor.ieee.org/802-ec/dcn/21/ec-21-0157-01-00EC-best-practices-for-mixed-mode-ieee-802-lmsc-sessions.docx. I tried to embed the meeting notes as comments in the document, hopefully you will be able to follow them. The next meeting for further refinement of the Mixed Mode Session Best Practices draft is scheduled for 16:00-17:00 ET Tuesday 24 August 2021. Your
homework assignment prior to that meeting is to draft and share what you consider the core principles for Mixed Mode Sessions should be via this 802 EC reflector. Non-real time exchange and consensus building via the reflector will make next week's call more
productive. Thank you for your time today, --Paul To unsubscribe from the STDS-802-SEC list, click the following link:
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