At great personal
risk....I did not understand the debate about the ballot pool this
morning so I went to the SBOM. This is what I found
(bold+underline added):
5.4.2 Ballot invitations
IEEE Standards balloting groups shall be formed by means
of ballot invitations conducted by the IEEE Standards Balloting
Center. A ballot invitation is sent to all parties known by the
Sponsor to be interested in the subject matter of the proposed
standard. Information
about IEEE Standards Sponsor ballot invitations shall also be made
available at the IEEE Standards website to allow additional
interested parties the opportunity to participate.
Ballot invitations shall remain open for a period of no
less than 15 days. Those who respond affirmatively to
the invitation during the period in which the ballot invitation is
open and who otherwise fulfill the criteria in both subclause 5.2.2.3
of the IEEE-SA Standards Board Bylaws and 5.4.1
shall become members of the balloting group for that proposed
standard. If a ballot does not open within 6 months of the
invitation close date, the ballot group will be considered
invalid and the Sponsor shall conduct a new invitation.
Once the ballot has begun, no changes shall be made to the
membership of the balloting group.
Perhaps there is a clause elsewhere in the
OM or SB Bylaws that allows a different action. I would
welcome additional information that leads to a different
conclusion based the governing rules?
Not sure that helps....but there it is.
B
On 6/2/2015 3:41 PM, ROBERT GROW wrote:
Bob:
IEEE SA staff is not the Standards Association, and they have
no more authority to interpret the rules than you, James or I.
ProCom, the SASB and the BOG are the keepers of the rules, not
staff. ProCom is responsible for interpretations of the SASB
Ops Man, not staff, and as evidenced by previous myProject
problems, the interpretation of the rules made by the myProject
programmer(s) has no more authority than a staff interpretation.
Therefore, it looks to me that the invitation process
presents risk. As a former RevCom member, the time gap between
the invitation close and the 5 day extension would be
troublesome. RevCom is unpredictable and every year has a
slightly different character. In my years of SASB activity,
RevCom has more than once contradicted staff advice to a WG
Chair.
The second risk is appeal. If that happened, it falls to the
appeals officer to determine if it is frivolous or of substance.
Having served as the IEEE SASB Vice Chair for Appeals years
ago, I would have allowed an appeal had this action come before
me, simply based on a direct reading of SASB Operation Manual
5.4.2, and the innovation close notice James sent below. If the
currently relevant appeals officer felt similarly, it puts the
matter in the hands of an appeals panel. If the appellant
specified the rule, the announcement of close and a highly
disconnected in time extension, and your argument was that you
were simply following staff advice, I am less than confident
that the panel would decide in your favor.
I’ll not argue what you should do, simply highlight the risks
you are taking on for both RevCom when it considers the project,
and providing possible grounds for appeal.
Bob Grow
James
The SA is the keeper of the rules. I consulted them on
the age of
the pool and whether we could proceed and if not what
action should be
taken. Their recommendation was to reopen the invite for
5 days, which I
did. MyProject did not object. It sounds like your
disagreement is with
the Standards Association.
Regards
Bob
At 02:05 PM 6/2/2015 -0700, James P. K. Gilb wrote:
Bob
MyProject is supposed to implement, roughly, the
rules. It does not
define them. In some instances, it does not allow
correct
implementation.
The fact that MyProject allows you to change the end
date of the
invitation is a bug, not a feature as the invitation
was not open between
December 6, 2014 and 15 May 2015.
IMHO.
James Gilb
On 06/02/2015 08:59 AM, Bob Heile wrote:
James
That all fine and well but it is not what MyProject
says or allows.
All
I can say is, I consulted with the SA on the proper
process and
followed
their recommendations to the letter. And people in
the invite pool
who
had not joined previously saw it and joined so it
did what it was
supposed to do. I did not check to see if anyone
chose to drop out. I
am
assuming not.
Regards
Bob
At 08:44 AM 6/2/2015 -0700, James P. K. Gilb wrote:
Bob
The invite opened on November 5, 2014 and closed
on December 5,
2014,
after that people were not able to join the pool.
The invite automatically closes unless you choose
to extend it.
It
was not extended, hence it closed on December 5,
2014.
See the message below:
--------------------------------------------------------------------
To: "C/LM/WG802.15/802.15.4q Sponsor Ballot
Designee"
<drsemami@yahoo.com>,
"C/LM/WG802.15 Chair"
<bheile@ieee.org>,
"C/LM/WG802.15 Chair" <bob_heile@yahoo.com>,
"C/LM
Standards
Representative" <gilb@ieee.org>
Subject: Your invitation for IEEE P802.15.4q has
closed
This notification is to advise you that the
invitation for
P802.15.4q
IEEE Standard for Local and metropolitan area
networks--Part 15.4:
Low-Rate Wireless Personal Area Networks
(LR-WPANs) Amendment for an
Ultra Low Power Physical Layer has closed. Please
log on to
myProject
https://development.standards.ieee.org/my-site/ballot-invitation-summary
to review your ballot group mix to ensure that it
is balanced.
If
your group is balanced and the document is ready,
you may start your
ballot at any time by going to "Initiate Sponsor
Ballot" on
your
control panel.
Thank you.
---------------------------------------------------------------
The pool is stale and needs a new invitation as
per the SASB OM.
James Gilb
On 06/01/2015 05:30 PM, Bob Heile wrote:
James
Per your suggestion in YVR. I reopened the
invite that evening.
Since
it turns out I never really closed the initial
invite, the SA
suggested
I simply reopen it for 5 days, which is what I
did. That brings the
pool
up to date. There were several additions. The
official close date is
now
May 19, 2015. I then took the new expanded pool
and sent it Lisa and
Paul to judge the balance and if satisfied to
approve the pool,
which
they have done. The SA is happy and we are good
to go.
Regards
Bob
At 05:03 PM 6/1/2015 -0700, James P. K. Gilb
wrote:
Bob
The ballot pool for that Sponsor ballot will
expire on June 6, 2015
(the original invitation ended on December 6,
2014).
Have you re-formed the ballot pool per the
SASB OM 5.4.2?
"If a ballot does not open within 6 months of
the invitation
close
date, the ballot group will be considered
invalid and the Sponsor
shall conduct a new invitation."
The minimum time for an invitation is 15 days.
James Gilb
On 06/01/2015 04:56 PM, Bob Heile wrote:
Greetings
all-
Attached is the Conditional Approval Request
Package for 15.4q we
will
be discussing on tomorrow's call. Let me
know if you have any
questions.
Regards
Bob
Bob Heile, Ph.D
Director of Standards, Wi-SUN Alliance
Chair, IEEE 802.15 Working Group on Wireless
Specialty Networks
Chair IEEE 2030.5 Working Group for Smart
Energy Profile 2
Co-Chair IEEE P2030 Task Force 3 on
Smartgrid Communications
11 Robert Toner Blvd, Suite 5-301
North Attleboro, MA 02763 USA
Mobile: +1-781-929-4832
email: bheile@ieee.org
----------
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Committee email reflector.
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This email is sent from the 802 Executive
Committee email reflector.
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Bob Heile, Ph.D
Director of Standards, Wi-SUN Alliance
Chair, IEEE 802.15 Working Group on Wireless
Specialty Networks
Chair IEEE 2030.5 Working Group for Smart Energy
Profile 2
Co-Chair IEEE P2030 Task Force 3 on Smartgrid
Communications
11 Robert Toner Blvd, Suite 5-301
North Attleboro, MA 02763 USA
Mobile: +1-781-929-4832
email: bheile@ieee.org
Bob Heile, Ph.D
Director of Standards, Wi-SUN Alliance
Chair, IEEE 802.15 Working Group on Wireless
Specialty Networks
Chair IEEE 2030.5 Working Group for Smart Energy
Profile 2
Co-Chair IEEE P2030 Task Force 3 on Smartgrid
Communications
11 Robert Toner Blvd, Suite 5-301
North Attleboro, MA 02763 USA
Mobile: +1-781-929-4832
email: bheile@ieee.org
Bob Heile, Ph.D
Director of Standards, Wi-SUN Alliance
Chair, IEEE 802.15 Working Group on Wireless
Specialty Networks
Chair IEEE 2030.5 Working Group for Smart Energy
Profile 2
Co-Chair IEEE P2030 Task Force 3 on Smartgrid
Communications
11 Robert Toner Blvd, Suite 5-301
North Attleboro, MA 02763 USA
Mobile: +1-781-929-4832
email: bheile@ieee.org
----------
This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email
reflector. This list is maintained by Listserv.
----------
This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email
reflector. This list is maintained by Listserv.
----------
This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email reflector. This list is maintained by Listserv.
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