Re: [802SEC] +++ LMSC P&P Revision Ballot +++ WG Voting Rules
In my experience the WG chair has always been allowed to vote by the 802 rules. The chairs have usually chosen not to vote in meeting votes. They often have voted on Working Group letter ballots. The WG rules of 802.3 do not make any statements on this subject.
Regards,
Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-stds-802-sec@ieee.org [mailto:owner-stds-802-sec@ieee.org]On
Behalf Of Mike Takefman
Sent: Thursday, 10 February, 2005 7:35 AM
To: STDS-802-SEC@listserv.ieee.org
Subject: Re: [802SEC] +++ LMSC P&P Revision Ballot +++ WG Voting Rules
Steve,
I guess it depends more on what WGs you were in during your 802 time.
In my own personal case, I prefer to have the right to vote all the
time (not that I actually vote all the time, in fact more often then
not, I don't vote and just run the meeting).
What I don't like having is the expectation that if the WG makes
a close decision that I then have to be a decision maker. I find that
puts me in a worse political situation.
mike
Shellhammer, Stephen J wrote:
> Mike,
>
> I guess I need some background on this. During my time in IEEE
> 802 I have always understood that the Chair does not vote unless it
> changes the outcome. Is this more of a tradition than a rule? Maybe it
> is a rule in some working groups and not others. Anyone else have
> information of whether the individual working groups have rules that
> differ from the 802 rules? Maybe that is where I picked it up from.
>
> Also, I checked Roberts Rules and it states that the chair only
> votes
> 1) On ballots
> 2) If the chair's vote will change the result of the vote.
>
> I now feel like a real member of the EC now that I am quoting
> Roberts Rules :)
>
> Comments?
>
> Regards,
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mike Takefman [mailto:tak@cisco.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2005 3:34 AM
> To: Shellhammer, Stephen J
> Cc: STDS-802-SEC@listserv.ieee.org
> Subject: Re: [802SEC] +++ LMSC P&P Revision Ballot +++ WG Voting Rules
>
> I disagree with Steve on this one, a WG chair has
> always been able to vote at meetings on all issues
> unless otherwise amended by WG rules.
>
> Personally, I refuse to be disinfranchised from
> making technical decisions at meetings.
>
> mike
>
> Shellhammer, Stephen J wrote:
>
>>Matt,
>>
>>
>>
>> I vote Disapprove.
>>
>>
>>
>> My comments
>>
>>
>>
>>Procedural matters put by the Chair to the group may be decided by a
>>majority vote.
>>
>>
>>
>> This is vague. Procedure matters are either decided by a
>>majority or not. Saying it ?may? be decided by majority implies that
>>the chair can choose between 75% and a majority. The text should read
>
>
>>?Procedural matters put by the Chair to the group are decided by a
>
> majority?
>
>>
>>
>>The Working Group Chair may vote at meetings.
>>
>>
>>
>> This implies that the Chair can vote on any matter during
>
> a
>
>>meeting. It is my impression that the rules typically only allow the
>>Chair to vote if the Chair?s vote changes the outcome of the vote. I
>>believe that the rules should read in that manner. I believe the 802
>>Chair voting rules are that way.
>>
>>
>>
>> Numerical vote tallies must be taken on all matters that
>>will be brought before the EC.
>>
>>
>>
>> Good. I like that.
>>
>>
>>
>>Regards,
>>
>>Steve
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>>*From:* owner-stds-802-sec@ieee.org
>
> [mailto:owner-stds-802-sec@ieee.org]
>
>>*On Behalf Of *Sherman, Matthew J. (US SSA)
>>*Sent:* Friday, January 07, 2005 9:02 PM
>>*To:* STDS-802-SEC@listserv.ieee.org
>>*Subject:* [802SEC] +++ LMSC P&P Revision Ballot +++ WG Voting Rules
>>
>>
>>
>>Dear EC members,
>>
>>Attached you will find the text for an LMSC P&P revision ballot on WG
>>Voting Rules. This ballot was approved at the Friday November 19, 2004
>
>
>>EC meeting. The text is identical to that presented at the meeting.
>
> The
>
>>purpose and rationale for the ballot are as given in the attached
>
> ballot
>
>>document.
>>
>>Ballot Duration: 1/8/2005 - 2/8/2005 @ 11:59 PM EST
>>
>>WG/TAG chairs, please distribute this P&P revision ballot to your
>>groups, and invite them to comment through you.
>>
>>Thanks & Regards,
>>
>>Mat
>>
>><<802.0-WG_Voting_Rules-P&P_Revision_ballot.pdf>>
>>
>>Matthew Sherman, Ph.D.
>>
>>Senior Member Technical Staff
>>
>>BAE SYSTEMS, CNIR
>>
>>Office: +1 973.633.6344
>>
>>email: matthew.sherman@baesystems.com
>>
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>
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>
>
--
Michael Takefman tak@cisco.com
Distinguished Engineer, Cisco Systems
Chair IEEE 802.17 Stds WG
3000 Innovation Dr, Ottawa, Canada, K2K 3E8
voice: 613-254-3399 cell:613-220-6991
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