RE: [802SEC] Re: Wireless LCD Projectors for use at July plenaryat HR-SF
Buzz:
At a random web store, I see:
Epson PowerLite 735c wireless $3,099.99
Epson Powerlite 730c no wireless $2,699.99
So why would we want a built-in interface instead of one standalone
one? What is the advantage?
Roger
At 4:33 PM -0700 03/07/01, Rigsbee, Everett O wrote:
>Matt, I repeat: $300 - No !!! $4000 - Si !!!
>
>Thanx, Buzz
>Dr. Everett O. (Buzz) Rigsbee
>Boeing - SSG
>PO Box 3707, M/S: 7M-FM
>Seattle, WA 98124-2207
>(425) 865-2443 Fx: (425) 865-6721
>everett.o.rigsbee@boeing.com
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: mjsherman@research.att.com [mailto:mjsherman@research.att.com]
>Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 3:59 PM
>To: pat_thaler@agilent.com; tony@jeffree.co.uk
>Cc: millardo@dominetsystems.com; Rigsbee, Everett O;
>billq@attglobal.net; dawns@facetoface-events.com;
>darcel@facetoface-events.com; jennifer@facetoface-events.com;
>bheile@ieee.org; bob@airespace.com; p.nikolich@ieee.org;
>marks@boulder.nist.gov; stuart.kerry@philips.com;
>tgodfrey@intersil.com; apetrick@parkervision.com;
>donbe@microsoft.com; stds-802-sec@ieee.org; stuart@ok-brit.com;
>hworstell@research.att.com; rrm@research.att.com
>Subject: RE: [802SEC] Re: Wireless LCD Projectors for use at July
>plenary at HR-SF
>
>Pat,
>
>If it works Sunday (and folks in 802.11e are willing) I'd probably test
>it during the week under more stressful circumstances. Buzz seems to
>have demo units available, so that will do fine for me. Actually, I'd
>buy one myself and bring it to the meeting (a $300 unit that is) but we
>seem to be under very tight financial constraints here at AT&T right
>now. As for 802 buying the unit, if the $300 unit did not work, I
>assume we could return it. If it did work, we would probably want to
>keep it around anyway.
>
>As far as the advanced capabilities I was talking about, I did not think
>they were actually available at this time. It was just a suggestion of
>how the device could be useful beyond what current projectors do.
>
>Mat
>
>Matthew Sherman
>Vice Chair, IEEE 802
>Technology Consultant
>Communications Technology Research
>AT&T Labs - Shannon Laboratory
>Room B255, Building 103
>180 Park Avenue
>P.O. Box 971
>Florham Park, NJ 07932-0971
>Phone: +1 (973) 236-6925
>Fax: +1 (973) 360-5877
>EMAIL: mjsherman@att.com
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: pat_thaler@agilent.com [mailto:pat_thaler@agilent.com]
>Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 5:37 PM
>To: Sherman,Matthew J (Matthew); tony@jeffree.co.uk
>Cc: millardo@dominetsystems.com; everett.o.rigsbee@boeing.com;
>billq@attglobal.net; dawns@facetoface-events.com;
>darcel@facetoface-events.com; jennifer@facetoface-events.com;
>bheile@ieee.org; bob@airespace.com; p.nikolich@ieee.org;
>marks@boulder.nist.gov; stuart.kerry@philips.com; tgodfrey@intersil.com;
>apetrick@parkervision.com; donbe@microsoft.com; stds-802-sec@ieee.org;
>stuart@ok-brit.com; Worstell,Harry R (Harry); Miller,Robert R (Robert)
>Subject: RE: [802SEC] Re: Wireless LCD Projectors for use at July
>plenary at HR-SF
>
>I don't think a Sunday evening trial would answer the questions (except
>perhaps the question Can someone load the software onto their laptop and
>get it to work?). I'm sure it can work in that environment. The question
>is what happens when there are 100 laptops with .11 cards in the area.
>I'm pretty sure that in our real meeting rooms we would need to do
>something like plan to allocate the video to different channels so that
>it isn't competing with the general network traffic. Someone needs to do
>some planning on paper before we get very far.
>
>Also, I don't think we should buy one to test it. The purpose of the
>IEEE 802 treasury isn't to fund technology testing. If we want to try
>one, it should either be on the basis of getting a demo unit as Buzz
>suggested or by having a volunteer bring one.
>
>I also agree somewhat with Howard's sentiments.
>
>By the way, I'm fairly sure the unit I saw at the T10 meeting only
>allows one PC's video to drive it at a time. I don't think it has a
>feature for what you suggested: splitting the screen between two inputs
>at a time. What they got was freedom from having a video cable. At least
>some systems seemed to pay for that freedom with some performance
>penalty - not surprising because, instead of having the video card take
>care of driving the screen, the system processor has to get involved in
>sending network traffic.
>
>Pat
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: mjsherman@research.att.com [mailto:mjsherman@research.att.com]
>Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 2:53 PM
>To: tony@jeffree.co.uk
>Cc: millardo@dominetsystems.com; everett.o.rigsbee@boeing.com;
>billq@attglobal.net; dawns@facetoface-events.com;
>darcel@facetoface-events.com; jennifer@facetoface-events.com;
>bheile@ieee.org; bob@airespace.com; p.nikolich@ieee.org;
>marks@boulder.nist.gov; stuart.kerry@philips.com; tgodfrey@intersil.com;
>apetrick@parkervision.com; donbe@microsoft.com; stds-802-sec@ieee.org;
>stuart@ok-brit.com; hworstell@research.att.com; rrm@research.att.com
>Subject: RE: [802SEC] Re: Wireless LCD Projectors for use at July
>plenary at HR-SF
>
>
>
>In fact, I volunteer to try it out Sunday evening for the rules meeting
>(with a back up projector available of course!)
>
>Matthew Sherman
>Vice Chair, IEEE 802
>Technology Consultant
>Communications Technology Research
>AT&T Labs - Shannon Laboratory
>Room B255, Building 103
>180 Park Avenue
>P.O. Box 971
>Florham Park, NJ 07932-0971
>Phone: +1 (973) 236-6925
>Fax: +1 (973) 360-5877
>EMAIL: mjsherman@att.com
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Tony Jeffree [mailto:tony@jeffree.co.uk]
>Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 4:36 PM
>To: Sherman,Matthew J (Matthew)
>Cc: millardo@dominetsystems.com; everett.o.rigsbee@boeing.com;
>billq@attglobal.net; dawns@facetoface-events.com;
>darcel@facetoface-events.com; jennifer@facetoface-events.com;
>bheile@ieee.org; bob@airespace.com; p.nikolich@ieee.org;
>marks@boulder.nist.gov; stuart.kerry@philips.com; tgodfrey@intersil.com;
>apetrick@parkervision.com; donbe@microsoft.com; stds-802-sec@ieee.org;
>stuart@ok-brit.com; Worstell,Harry R (Harry); Miller,Robert R (Robert)
>Subject: RE: [802SEC] Re: Wireless LCD Projectors for use at July
>plenary at HR-SF
>
>Mat -
>
>There are obviously two laudable goals here:
>
>1) Getting work done in meetings; and
>2) Testing out the technology that we develop in real working
>environments.
>
>Unfortunately, it is not clear to me that these goals are not in
>conflict.
>
>Putting it another way, I think it is a great idea for you to guinea-pig
>
>these new devices in your meetings ;-)
>
>Regards,
>Tony
>
>At 17:19 01/07/2003 -0400, mjsherman@research.att.com wrote:
>
>>Hi everyone,
>>
>>So I'll add one more opinion to the pile. I think it is important that
>>we try new things and see how they work, especially if they are our own
>>technologies. If we won't buy it, who will?
>>
>>I can see value for a projector with a wireless interface - where a guy
>>in the back of the room can quickly display their objection on the
>>screen, or where you might even be able to briefly split the screen
>>between two inputs for comparison. But frankly, I am perplexed by the
>>software and control issues - another reason why I want to try it so I
>>can see first hand if it works or not.
>>
>>Another area of personal concern for me is whether the RF environment
>in
>>our meetings can hack it. I'm already not very happy with the
>>performance we get out of our current WLAN without a video load.
>>802.11e (QoS) is not out yet. So, I can't wait to see what happens
>when
>>we add a video load in with our existing loads. Will the WLAN be able
>>to handle the load? Will other traffic in the area impact the quality
>>of the video on the projector?
>>
>>I view IEEE 802 not just as a standards development organization, but a
>>as a potential test bed for our own technologies. Actually, I wish we
>>did more testing and evaluation of the network we run here. The one
>>thing I will caution is I'm not sure myself if an investment in the
>>projector will be worth while, so don't buy more than one. I think it
>>is worth buying one though just to find out if it is worth while.
>>
>>Mat
>>
>>Matthew Sherman
>>Vice Chair, IEEE 802
> >Technology Consultant
>>Communications Technology Research
>>AT&T Labs - Shannon Laboratory
>>Room B255, Building 103
>>180 Park Avenue
>>P.O. Box 971
>>Florham Park, NJ 07932-0971
>>Phone: +1 (973) 236-6925
>>Fax: +1 (973) 360-5877
>>EMAIL: mjsherman@att.com
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Howard Frazier [mailto:millardo@dominetsystems.com]
>>Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 2:08 PM
>>To: Rigsbee, Everett O
>>Cc: billq@attglobal.net; 802 @F2F Dawn S; darcel@facetoface-events.com;
>>802 @F2F Jennifer Hull; 802 Bob Heile; Bob O'Hara; Paul Nikolich
>>(E-mail); 802 Roger B. Marks; 802 Stuart J. Kerry; Tim Godfrey; 802. 11
>>Al Petrick (802-11 Al Petrick); Don Berry; 802 Exec; stuart@ok-brit.com
>>Subject: [802SEC] Re: Wireless LCD Projectors for use at July plenary
>at
>>HR-SF
>>
>>
>>
>>Personally, I would not pay extra $ for a projector
>>with a wireless interface. Based on bitter experience,
>>I never add software or hardware to my laptop while I
>>am traveling, so I loathe the idea of having to add
>>some new driver for this interface.
>>
>>The time required to connect a cable to a projector
>>is minimal. Time is occasionally wasted when a
>>presenter can't figure out how to toggle between
>>their laptop's LCD and the external monitor interface,
>>or when this simple action produces a "Microsoft Moment".
>>I can't see where adding a couple of layers of complexity
>>will improve the situation. For large, busy groups that
>>need to save time, the best technique is to load all
>>of the presentation materials onto one laptop, thus
>>avoiding the need to switch connections.
>>
>>In the five years that we have been buying projectors,
>>I have learned that "bells and whistles" like cameras
>>are pretty much useless. I would put a wireless interface
>>into the same category. It's just one more thing that
>>can break, requiring a potentially costly repair, and
>>taking a projector out of service.
>>
>>Let's please stick with simple, durable, bright,
>>high-resolution DLP projectors with minimal bells and whistles.
>>
>>Howard (Yes, I'm a Luddite, and proud of it) Frazier
>>
>>Rigsbee, Everett O wrote:
>>
>> > FYI- I just happened to stumble across the Epson 735c Wireless LCD
>>Projector (see attached specification sheet) and thought this might
>just
>>be the thing for our future meetings, but wondered if anyone has had
>any
>>experience with this unit, and has opinions on its suitability for use
>>at IEEE 802 plenaries and interims.
>> >
>> > It seems to be price competitive with the regular wired units, and
>>might allow a lot more flexibility in sharing an LCD projector amongst
>>several presenters.
>> >
>> > Input and opinions on this notion are encouraged.
>> >
>> > I'm working on seeing if we can get a couple of these units to use
>in
>>SF for evaluation purposes. Any support for this from our Epson folks
>>would be seriously appreciated. :-)
>> >
>> > Thanx, Buzz
>> > Dr. Everett O. (Buzz) Rigsbee
>> > Boeing - SSG
>> > PO Box 3707, M/S: 7M-FM
>> > Seattle, WA 98124-2207
>> > (425) 865-2443 Fx: (425) 865-6721
>> > everett.o.rigsbee@boeing.com
>> >
>> >
>> >
>
>Regards,
>Tony