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Re: [802SEC] +++10 Day EC Email Ballot+++ 802.1aq book signing

All
I was part of one of those signing events as an author, but I was not an EC member and so I don't recall if a vote was run.
I have not voted on this as I didn't know that we had the ability to authorize (or prevent) the actions of IEEE staff. Is the question that we want to allow the activity at our plenary and that without the EC permission it might be seen as non-standards related?
If so, then perhaps we should be prepared to allow any other publisher of 802 standards related books to sponsor similar author signing and sales. They could certainly be seen as relevant to our standards effort.
And then, if we do that, should there be a fee for the table? IEEE MTT-S, for example, has a Symposium with presentation of refereed papers as well as an industry exhibition. The revenue from the exhibition goes a long way to paying for the papers side of the symposium. It is not profit making because all the revenue goes to expenses. 

James Gilb

On 05/24/2012 01:05 AM, Tony Jeffree wrote:

I also have that recollection.

Regards,
Tony



On 24 May 2012 08:51, Pat Thaler<pthaler@broadcom.com>  wrote:


I recall signing events - there was one for the EPON book and, I think,
another for a wireless book. I don't recall doing a motion in those cases.

-----Original Message-----
From: ***** IEEE 802 Executive Committee List ***** [mailto:
STDS-802-SEC@ieee.org] On Behalf Of Geoff Thompson
Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2012 12:12 PM
To: STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [802SEC] +++10 Day EC Email Ballot+++ 802.1aq book signing

Tony-

On 235//12 10:02 AM, Tony Jeffree wrote:

Geoff -

We have had similar signing events in the past for books published by
the IEEE on LAN topics, and have also had IEEE book stalls at our
Plenaries in the past, selling a wider range of IEEE publications.


I do recall the IEEE having a table where they peddled goods from their
profit making arms.
I do not recall signing events.
I recognize the similarity of this to the event we are talking about.  I
have never been wild about these but have recognized these are more or
less part of what comes with the SA being a subsidiary of the
Institute.  I think the space between this and a signing event for the
same merchandise is a shallow and slippery slope but I do think the line
is right about here.


And actually, developing/selling standards is also supposed to be an
IEEE profit making operation - are you suggesting we are over the line
there too?


While selling standards may or may not be (or supposed to be) a profit
making operation, it is undertaken by an arm of the IEEE that is most
definitely under the portion of the SA that is both "not for profit" and
"for the benefit of humanity".  They are "our (consensus) product"
(rather than the independent product of some of our members).

I have no problem with any activity or promotion that we take to sell
standards.  That is proper and not "over the line".  I would have
absolutely no problem with a booth at an 802 Plenary selling (at a
premium even) signed copies of any of our standards.  (Frankly I'm a
little surprised that Roger hasn't done that already.)


The issue here is the sanctioned promotion of the sale of a class of
unballoted non-consensus publications that are potentially opinion
pieces not subject to any of the checks and balances of the standards
process.

Best regards,

     Geoff



Regards,
Tony



On 23 May 2012 17:45, Geoff Thompson<thompson@ieee.org
<mailto:thompson@ieee.org>>  wrote:

     Colleagues-

     As usual, I am not allowed to vote on this.
     I am uncomfortable with this though as being overly commercial.
     I think this activity dances on the line.

     This is a commercial promotion for a profit making operation
     within the
     IEEE.
     We have had numerous other books written by standards luminaries
     specifically and equally focused about other standards.  They have
     often
     been published by others than the IEEE.  I would find it difficult to
     deny them equal opportunity to promote an equal (or better)
     product that
     was focused on one of our efforts.

     I don't think this is a clear call but I would rather we avoid the
     line
     than dance over it.

     Best regards,

        Geoff

     On 235//12 7:01 AM, Tony Jeffree wrote:

         Paul has authorized me to run an email ballot on the following
         motion:

         Motion:  Grant permission to IEEE-SA staff to organize,
         promote and conduct
         sales of a book on 802.1aq, including author signing, at the
         July 802
         plenary.

         Moved: Jeffree Seconded: Thaler

         Background:

         This book, which is published through IEEE, was written by two
         members of
         the 802.1 WG who were contributors to the work on IEEE Std.
         802.1aq which
         was approved by SASB in March 2012.



         This will be a 10-day ballot, closing on 3rd June 2012 AOE; as
         per current
         P&P I will terminate the ballot early if it is clear that the
         outcome has
         been decided.

         Regards,
         Tony

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